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gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 06-28-2012 12:11 AM

james -

i'm reposting the following from your mmb board:

"james -

we've written back and forth a few times, and i appreciate the help you've given me thus far. however, i remain pretty stuck in my treatment and would appreciate some further advice.

i've not had an official diagnosis, but my main symptoms are loose smelly stools with lots of undigested food, strong foul smelling perspiration, intermittent stomach pain after eating (previously every meal, currently maybe once per week), depression, inability to gain weight, anxiety, and tightness in my chest. i suspect thyroid is involved, as my waking body temp is usually around 97.0, has been down to 96.7. very low blood pressure (95/60). hay fever. pulse spikes on going from sitting to standing, and is sometimes accompanied with lightheaded feeling and visual blurriness. previously took accutane, which i have been told is implicated in several inflammatory conditions such as colitis.

i've been taking your adrenal, thyroid, and liv-r-right formulas for two months now, along with amla berry and parsley. recently been taking magnesium malate and lecithin. been on elimination diet for food allergies for about 3 months (off gluten, soy, egg, corn, peanuts, dairy completely. reintroduced nightshades and red meat and seem to be doing fine with them) no caffeine or alcohol. i've also been supplementing glycine 3x/day to help with anxiety, but doesn't seem to be helping. anxiety mainly stems from worrying over my physical state, fears i'm not locating the cause or following the right protocol etc. i have had a longstanding fear of heart disease since childhood and hearing that rates are higher in low thyroid patients has scared the hell out of me. smoked from age 19-24, no more than 3 or 4 cigarettes a day, and half that time i wasn't smoking anyway. none since. 26 now. before all this set on, about a year ago (due probably to immense stress from all angles) i was in decent cardio shape, 6:00 mile, ran regularly for distance, swam, etc. initial onset of symptoms occured at an extremely high stress time and was accompanied with fever which abated in a day.

what concerns me most now is chest pain. began about a month ago as a dull tightness, then in the last week got more intense and feels like a constant low level burn centered over the breastbone but moving around and increasing/decreasing in intensity throughout the day. i wake up with it and go to sleep with it and nothing seems to help it. i have been told it's probably just anxiety, and have had ekg came back normal. my pulse is never very high, highest it will get during the day is maybe 85, usually stays around 60.

have had labs for stomach. blood panel came back nothing out of the ordinary though i know what that counts for. diagnostechs gi panel came back nothing out of the ordinary but super high for gut inflammation. adrenal saliva came back normal.

my questions to you are:
do you see any pattern here that would lead you to suspect a certain underlying cause? what other labs/tests would you order? (i'm uninsured and limited income but i have enough to do what i need to do, i just don't want to be throwing money everywhere at things i don't likely need). are there any contraindications with the formulas i'm taking? anything else i should be supplementing? if there is possibly a deeper autoimmune condition here, what would you suspect and how should i go about sorting that out?

i've written before about doing a phone consultation with you. if that is possible anytime in the near future, please let me know. otherwise, i appreciate any advice or direction you can offer. thanks so much for everything you do.

--

should add that thyroid blood test just came back, tsh quite high, t4 normal, t3 low. don't have the exact numbers but my ND defined those relative values in spite of the fact that all 3 were technically in the "lab normal" range.

this link http://www.keratosispilaris.org/general-discussion/9456-uh-oh-retinoic-acid-retin-accutane-culprit-celiac-disease.html

has me wondering about possible autoimmune from accutane use, as i've heard that "low t3 syndrome" can be a consequence of underlying autoimmune causes. what do you think?

- drew"

since i've posted that, about six weeks, i've been doing the GAPS diet and about 2 cups of raw goat yogurt per day, and diarrhea is down as is stomach upset. no gas to speak of. however my basal temp still clocks in at between 96.6 and 97.0 every morning. my stools still show some undigested food and are quite soft still, but better formed and not floating. chest tightness comes and goes in intensity but is pretty much a daily thing. sensation of like a light pressure on the center of my chest, nothing major, like a 2/10 usually and can go up to 4 or 5 occasionally. feels hard to get a good breath. ND suspects anxiety causing chest pain and possibly autoimmune/colitis/crohn's or possibly SIBO (since gi panel came back normal for gut bacteria).

any advice is appreciated, as always. thanks james.

- drew


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - MarciGal - 06-28-2012 02:32 PM

(06-28-2012 12:11 AM)yuba13 Wrote:  james -

i'm reposting the following from your mmb board:

"james -

we've written back and forth a few times, and i appreciate the help you've given me thus far. however, i remain pretty stuck in my treatment and would appreciate some further advice.

i've not had an official diagnosis, but my main symptoms are loose smelly stools with lots of undigested food, strong foul smelling perspiration, intermittent stomach pain after eating (previously every meal, currently maybe once per week), depression, inability to gain weight, anxiety, and tightness in my chest. i suspect thyroid is involved, as my waking body temp is usually around 97.0, has been down to 96.7. very low blood pressure (95/60). hay fever. pulse spikes on going from sitting to standing, and is sometimes accompanied with lightheaded feeling and visual blurriness. previously took accutane, which i have been told is implicated in several inflammatory conditions such as colitis.

i've been taking your adrenal, thyroid, and liv-r-right formulas for two months now, along with amla berry and parsley. recently been taking magnesium malate and lecithin. been on elimination diet for food allergies for about 3 months (off gluten, soy, egg, corn, peanuts, dairy completely. reintroduced nightshades and red meat and seem to be doing fine with them) no caffeine or alcohol. i've also been supplementing glycine 3x/day to help with anxiety, but doesn't seem to be helping. anxiety mainly stems from worrying over my physical state, fears i'm not locating the cause or following the right protocol etc. i have had a longstanding fear of heart disease since childhood and hearing that rates are higher in low thyroid patients has scared the hell out of me. smoked from age 19-24, no more than 3 or 4 cigarettes a day, and half that time i wasn't smoking anyway. none since. 26 now. before all this set on, about a year ago (due probably to immense stress from all angles) i was in decent cardio shape, 6:00 mile, ran regularly for distance, swam, etc. initial onset of symptoms occured at an extremely high stress time and was accompanied with fever which abated in a day.

what concerns me most now is chest pain. began about a month ago as a dull tightness, then in the last week got more intense and feels like a constant low level burn centered over the breastbone but moving around and increasing/decreasing in intensity throughout the day. i wake up with it and go to sleep with it and nothing seems to help it. i have been told it's probably just anxiety, and have had ekg came back normal. my pulse is never very high, highest it will get during the day is maybe 85, usually stays around 60.

have had labs for stomach. blood panel came back nothing out of the ordinary though i know what that counts for. diagnostechs gi panel came back nothing out of the ordinary but super high for gut inflammation. adrenal saliva came back normal.

my questions to you are:
do you see any pattern here that would lead you to suspect a certain underlying cause? what other labs/tests would you order? (i'm uninsured and limited income but i have enough to do what i need to do, i just don't want to be throwing money everywhere at things i don't likely need). are there any contraindications with the formulas i'm taking? anything else i should be supplementing? if there is possibly a deeper autoimmune condition here, what would you suspect and how should i go about sorting that out?

i've written before about doing a phone consultation with you. if that is possible anytime in the near future, please let me know. otherwise, i appreciate any advice or direction you can offer. thanks so much for everything you do.

--

should add that thyroid blood test just came back, tsh quite high, t4 normal, t3 low. don't have the exact numbers but my ND defined those relative values in spite of the fact that all 3 were technically in the "lab normal" range.

this link http://www.keratosispilaris.org/general-discussion/9456-uh-oh-retinoic-acid-retin-accutane-culprit-celiac-disease.html

has me wondering about possible autoimmune from accutane use, as i've heard that "low t3 syndrome" can be a consequence of underlying autoimmune causes. what do you think?

- drew"

since i've posted that, about six weeks, i've been doing the GAPS diet and about 2 cups of raw goat yogurt per day, and diarrhea is down as is stomach upset. no gas to speak of. however my basal temp still clocks in at between 96.6 and 97.0 every morning. my stools still show some undigested food and are quite soft still, but better formed and not floating. chest tightness comes and goes in intensity but is pretty much a daily thing. sensation of like a light pressure on the center of my chest, nothing major, like a 2/10 usually and can go up to 4 or 5 occasionally. feels hard to get a good breath. ND suspects anxiety causing chest pain and possibly autoimmune/colitis/crohn's or possibly SIBO (since gi panel came back normal for gut bacteria).

any advice is appreciated, as always. thanks james.

- drew

Hi drew ... some of your symptoms are things I'm dealing with and I'm finding a lot of them 'can' be from gallstones or gallbladder 'disease' ... the pain from a low functioning gallbladder is often in the stomach, abdomen, sides, chest, back, neck ... all over the place. When I get an 'attack' I take Epsom Salts with warm water and it relaxes the ducts and the pain disappears within 20-30 minutes depending on if I have food in my stomach at the time. Just a thought you might consider if you haven't already.

All the best ...

Marci


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 06-29-2012 02:04 AM

(06-28-2012 12:11 AM)yuba13 Wrote:  james -

i'm reposting the following from your mmb board:

"james -

we've written back and forth a few times, and i appreciate the help you've given me thus far. however, i remain pretty stuck in my treatment and would appreciate some further advice.

i've not had an official diagnosis, but my main symptoms are loose smelly stools with lots of undigested food, strong foul smelling perspiration, intermittent stomach pain after eating (previously every meal, currently maybe once per week), depression, inability to gain weight, anxiety, and tightness in my chest. i suspect thyroid is involved, as my waking body temp is usually around 97.0, has been down to 96.7.

Yes, that is low enough to indicate hypothyroidism. Hypothyroidism also leads to increased inflammation due to a rise in inflammatory homocysteine.

very low blood pressure (95/60). hay fever. pulse spikes on going from sitting to standing, and is sometimes accompanied with lightheaded feeling and visual blurriness.

These adrenal issues.

previously took accutane, which i have been told is implicated in several inflammatory conditions such as colitis.

Accutane can damage the liver as well.

i've been taking your adrenal, thyroid, and liv-r-right formulas for two months now, along with amla berry and parsley. recently been taking magnesium malate and lecithin. been on elimination diet for food allergies for about 3 months (off gluten, soy, egg, corn, peanuts, dairy completely. reintroduced nightshades and red meat and seem to be doing fine with them) no caffeine or alcohol. i've also been supplementing glycine 3x/day to help with anxiety, but doesn't seem to be helping. anxiety mainly stems from worrying over my physical state,

Anxiety is most often from a rise in lactate, which can be reduced with nettle leaf. The other less common cause is excess epinephrine and a lack of acetylcholine. The lecithin granules will help to increase acetylcholine balancing out the epinephrine if this is the cause.

fears i'm not locating the cause or following the right protocol etc. i have had a longstanding fear of heart disease since childhood and hearing that rates are higher in low thyroid patients has scared the hell out of me.

Yes, again that is from the increased homocysteine. Trimethylglycine is a cheap and effective supplement to keep homocysteine down until you get your thyroid in order.


smoked from age 19-24, no more than 3 or 4 cigarettes a day, and half that time i wasn't smoking anyway. none since. 26 now. before all this set on, about a year ago (due probably to immense stress from all angles)

That would go a long way to explaining the adrenal dysfunction, which can also contribute to hypothyroidism.


i was in decent cardio shape, 6:00 mile, ran regularly for distance, swam, etc. initial onset of symptoms occured at an extremely high stress time and was accompanied with fever which abated in a day.

what concerns me most now is chest pain. began about a month ago as a dull tightness, then in the last week got more intense and feels like a constant low level burn centered over the breastbone but moving around and increasing/decreasing in intensity throughout the day. i wake up with it and go to sleep with it and nothing seems to help it. i have been told it's probably just anxiety, and have had ekg came back normal. my pulse is never very high, highest it will get during the day is maybe 85, usually stays around 60.

It sounds like reflux, which can tie in to the digestive disorders and gastritis as well:

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2601

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2632

have had labs for stomach. blood panel came back nothing out of the ordinary though i know what that counts for. diagnostechs gi panel came back nothing out of the ordinary but super high for gut inflammation. adrenal saliva came back normal.

Gut inflammation could be a number of things including low flora levels, colitis, ulcerative colitis, Crohn's and diverticulitis.

my questions to you are:
do you see any pattern here that would lead you to suspect a certain underlying cause? what other labs/tests would you order? (i'm uninsured and limited income but i have enough to do what i need to do, i just don't want to be throwing money everywhere at things i don't likely need). are there any contraindications with the formulas i'm taking? anything else i should be supplementing? if there is possibly a deeper autoimmune condition here, what would you suspect and how should i go about sorting that out?

Before spending a whole lot of money on a bunch of lab tests that are often very inaccurate anyway I have a few suggestions for you.

It sounds like a large part of your problem is from a fat malabsorption disorder. This could be from an intestinal inflammatory disorder or an issue with the gallbladder, such as a lack of one.

One suggestion is to work on building your flora back up with cultured foods and either rice or oat bran. The brans will also provide B vitamins that can assist the liver with detoxification processes.

The formulas you are taking are all compatible. With the Live-R-Ight though, if you are using the capsules I recommend opening them up and putting the powder on the tongue to act as a bitter. Only do this if you still have your gallbladder. This helps with digestion and absorption as well as helping the gallbladder and liver.

This should also help with the bad smelling perspiration, which can be from liver dysfunction not breaking down ammonia compounds properly.

Don't forget to drink plenty of water throughout the day when using the bitters.

I already mentioned nettle leaf and TMG.

The other thing would be yucca root powder. The powder provides fiber to help the flora and the yucca root reduces intestinal inflammation. Don't use it in cases of digestive system ulcerations though. Licorice root powder can also be added or substituted for yucca root powder.


i've written before about doing a phone consultation with you. if that is possible anytime in the near future, please let me know. otherwise, i appreciate any advice or direction you can offer. thanks so much for everything you do.

I can try to set something up. Send me an e-mail with a reminder, contact information and your time zone.

--

should add that thyroid blood test just came back, tsh quite high, t4 normal, t3 low. don't have the exact numbers but my ND defined those relative values in spite of the fact that all 3 were technically in the "lab normal" range.

Between the high TSH and low body temperature there is definitely a low thyroid issue. But there are numerous causes of hypothyroidism so narrowing down the cause can be a bit tricky.

this link http://www.keratosispilaris.org/general-discussion/9456-uh-oh-retinoic-acid-retin-accutane-culprit-celiac-disease.html

has me wondering about possible autoimmune from accutane use, as i've heard that "low t3 syndrome" can be a consequence of underlying autoimmune causes. what do you think?

There can be a lot more to the whole thing. Note that Celiac is a inherited condition and differs from a gluten intolerance. And the IL-15 they refer to will increase inflammation, but this does not make it the cause of the condition.

As for low T3, again there can be more than one cause. For example, adrenal dysfunction that also happens to be associated with autoimmune disorders.


- drew"

since i've posted that, about six weeks, i've been doing the GAPS diet and about 2 cups of raw goat yogurt per day, and diarrhea is down as is stomach upset. no gas to speak of.

Yes, that makes sense and building up the flora can reduce intestinal inflammation in large part by reducing pathogens. Don't forget to feed the flora though with fibers.

however my basal temp still clocks in at between 96.6 and 97.0 every morning. my stools still show some undigested food and are quite soft still, but better formed and not floating.

The stool not floating is a good sign. Less fats being excreted in the stool.

As for the low temperature again there are various causes of hypothyroidism. There could be something going on that it keeping it suppressed such as chronic stress, spending time in a pool or spa, eating raw goitrogenic vegetables, etc.


chest tightness comes and goes in intensity but is pretty much a daily thing. sensation of like a light pressure on the center of my chest, nothing major, like a 2/10 usually and can go up to 4 or 5 occasionally. feels hard to get a good breath. ND suspects anxiety causing chest pain and possibly autoimmune/colitis/crohn's or possibly SIBO (since gi panel came back normal for gut bacteria).

With the burning sensation you mentioned earlier I still think it is more of a reflux issue.

any advice is appreciated, as always. thanks james.

- drew



RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 06-30-2012 05:23 PM

(06-29-2012 02:04 AM)James Wrote:  
(06-28-2012 12:11 AM)yuba13 Wrote:  james -

i'm reposting the following from your mmb board:

"james -

we've written back and forth a few times, and i appreciate the help you've given me thus far. however, i remain pretty stuck in my treatment and would appreciate some further advice.

i've not had an official diagnosis, but my main symptoms are loose smelly stools with lots of undigested food, strong foul smelling perspiration, intermittent stomach pain after eating (previously every meal, currently maybe once per week), depression, inability to gain weight, anxiety, and tightness in my chest. i suspect thyroid is involved, as my waking body temp is usually around 97.0, has been down to 96.7.

Yes, that is low enough to indicate hypothyroidism. Hypothyroidism also leads to increased inflammation due to a rise in inflammatory homocysteine.

very low blood pressure (95/60). hay fever. pulse spikes on going from sitting to standing, and is sometimes accompanied with lightheaded feeling and visual blurriness.

These adrenal issues.

previously took accutane, which i have been told is implicated in several inflammatory conditions such as colitis.

Accutane can damage the liver as well.

i've been taking your adrenal, thyroid, and liv-r-right formulas for two months now, along with amla berry and parsley. recently been taking magnesium malate and lecithin. been on elimination diet for food allergies for about 3 months (off gluten, soy, egg, corn, peanuts, dairy completely. reintroduced nightshades and red meat and seem to be doing fine with them) no caffeine or alcohol. i've also been supplementing glycine 3x/day to help with anxiety, but doesn't seem to be helping. anxiety mainly stems from worrying over my physical state,

Anxiety is most often from a rise in lactate, which can be reduced with nettle leaf. The other less common cause is excess epinephrine and a lack of acetylcholine. The lecithin granules will help to increase acetylcholine balancing out the epinephrine if this is the cause.

fears i'm not locating the cause or following the right protocol etc. i have had a longstanding fear of heart disease since childhood and hearing that rates are higher in low thyroid patients has scared the hell out of me.

Yes, again that is from the increased homocysteine. Trimethylglycine is a cheap and effective supplement to keep homocysteine down until you get your thyroid in order.


smoked from age 19-24, no more than 3 or 4 cigarettes a day, and half that time i wasn't smoking anyway. none since. 26 now. before all this set on, about a year ago (due probably to immense stress from all angles)

That would go a long way to explaining the adrenal dysfunction, which can also contribute to hypothyroidism.


i was in decent cardio shape, 6:00 mile, ran regularly for distance, swam, etc. initial onset of symptoms occured at an extremely high stress time and was accompanied with fever which abated in a day.

what concerns me most now is chest pain. began about a month ago as a dull tightness, then in the last week got more intense and feels like a constant low level burn centered over the breastbone but moving around and increasing/decreasing in intensity throughout the day. i wake up with it and go to sleep with it and nothing seems to help it. i have been told it's probably just anxiety, and have had ekg came back normal. my pulse is never very high, highest it will get during the day is maybe 85, usually stays around 60.

It sounds like reflux, which can tie in to the digestive disorders and gastritis as well:

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2601

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2632

have had labs for stomach. blood panel came back nothing out of the ordinary though i know what that counts for. diagnostechs gi panel came back nothing out of the ordinary but super high for gut inflammation. adrenal saliva came back normal.

Gut inflammation could be a number of things including low flora levels, colitis, ulcerative colitis, Crohn's and diverticulitis.

my questions to you are:
do you see any pattern here that would lead you to suspect a certain underlying cause? what other labs/tests would you order? (i'm uninsured and limited income but i have enough to do what i need to do, i just don't want to be throwing money everywhere at things i don't likely need). are there any contraindications with the formulas i'm taking? anything else i should be supplementing? if there is possibly a deeper autoimmune condition here, what would you suspect and how should i go about sorting that out?

Before spending a whole lot of money on a bunch of lab tests that are often very inaccurate anyway I have a few suggestions for you.

It sounds like a large part of your problem is from a fat malabsorption disorder. This could be from an intestinal inflammatory disorder or an issue with the gallbladder, such as a lack of one.

One suggestion is to work on building your flora back up with cultured foods and either rice or oat bran. The brans will also provide B vitamins that can assist the liver with detoxification processes.

The formulas you are taking are all compatible. With the Live-R-Ight though, if you are using the capsules I recommend opening them up and putting the powder on the tongue to act as a bitter. Only do this if you still have your gallbladder. This helps with digestion and absorption as well as helping the gallbladder and liver.

This should also help with the bad smelling perspiration, which can be from liver dysfunction not breaking down ammonia compounds properly.

Don't forget to drink plenty of water throughout the day when using the bitters.

I already mentioned nettle leaf and TMG.

The other thing would be yucca root powder. The powder provides fiber to help the flora and the yucca root reduces intestinal inflammation. Don't use it in cases of digestive system ulcerations though. Licorice root powder can also be added or substituted for yucca root powder.


i've written before about doing a phone consultation with you. if that is possible anytime in the near future, please let me know. otherwise, i appreciate any advice or direction you can offer. thanks so much for everything you do.

I can try to set something up. Send me an e-mail with a reminder, contact information and your time zone.

--

should add that thyroid blood test just came back, tsh quite high, t4 normal, t3 low. don't have the exact numbers but my ND defined those relative values in spite of the fact that all 3 were technically in the "lab normal" range.

Between the high TSH and low body temperature there is definitely a low thyroid issue. But there are numerous causes of hypothyroidism so narrowing down the cause can be a bit tricky.

this link http://www.keratosispilaris.org/general-discussion/9456-uh-oh-retinoic-acid-retin-accutane-culprit-celiac-disease.html

has me wondering about possible autoimmune from accutane use, as i've heard that "low t3 syndrome" can be a consequence of underlying autoimmune causes. what do you think?

There can be a lot more to the whole thing. Note that Celiac is a inherited condition and differs from a gluten intolerance. And the IL-15 they refer to will increase inflammation, but this does not make it the cause of the condition.

As for low T3, again there can be more than one cause. For example, adrenal dysfunction that also happens to be associated with autoimmune disorders.


- drew"

since i've posted that, about six weeks, i've been doing the GAPS diet and about 2 cups of raw goat yogurt per day, and diarrhea is down as is stomach upset. no gas to speak of.

Yes, that makes sense and building up the flora can reduce intestinal inflammation in large part by reducing pathogens. Don't forget to feed the flora though with fibers.

however my basal temp still clocks in at between 96.6 and 97.0 every morning. my stools still show some undigested food and are quite soft still, but better formed and not floating.

The stool not floating is a good sign. Less fats being excreted in the stool.

As for the low temperature again there are various causes of hypothyroidism. There could be something going on that it keeping it suppressed such as chronic stress, spending time in a pool or spa, eating raw goitrogenic vegetables, etc.


chest tightness comes and goes in intensity but is pretty much a daily thing. sensation of like a light pressure on the center of my chest, nothing major, like a 2/10 usually and can go up to 4 or 5 occasionally. feels hard to get a good breath. ND suspects anxiety causing chest pain and possibly autoimmune/colitis/crohn's or possibly SIBO (since gi panel came back normal for gut bacteria).

With the burning sensation you mentioned earlier I still think it is more of a reflux issue.

any advice is appreciated, as always. thanks james.

- drew

james -

what are your thoughts on the gaps diet? are you familiar with it? the protocol calls for drastically limited fiber intake, my understanding is that it's to starve out the bad bacteria. i'm taking plenty of kefir/yogurt/kvass etc. to build up the good. i've been following a diet of basically bone broth, chicken, beef, carrots, onions, squash, and non-goitrogenic greens for the last month and as i mentioned my stools are no longer floating, however it still seems clear to me that i'm not digesting very well (stools basically look like the food i've just eaten but mashed up). i've been taking bitters during that time before every meal per your recommendation.

would you recommend adding in apple cider vinegar to aid with stomach acid? if so how much and when?

i've been off of herbal formulas due to possible conflicts with gaps diet. again your thoughts on this would be appreciated. the protocol isn't one i'm dead set on following, but i've tried a lot over the last year and don't seem to be getting any better so i figured i'd give it a shot for now. i'm interested to hear what you have to say.

also, when is the best time to take tmg?

finally, what's the best e-mail at which to reach you for setting up a phone consult?

thanks again, james. your help is truly appreciated.

- drew


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 06-30-2012 09:13 PM

[/quote]
james -

what are your thoughts on the gaps diet? are you familiar with it? the protocol calls for drastically limited fiber intake, my understanding is that it's to starve out the bad bacteria. i'm taking plenty of kefir/yogurt/kvass etc. to build up the good. i've been following a diet of basically bone broth, chicken, beef, carrots, onions, squash, and non-goitrogenic greens for the last month and as i mentioned my stools are no longer floating, however it still seems clear to me that i'm not digesting very well (stools basically look like the food i've just eaten but mashed up). i've been taking bitters during that time before every meal per your recommendation.

would you recommend adding in apple cider vinegar to aid with stomach acid? if so how much and when?

i've been off of herbal formulas due to possible conflicts with gaps diet. again your thoughts on this would be appreciated. the protocol isn't one i'm dead set on following, but i've tried a lot over the last year and don't seem to be getting any better so i figured i'd give it a shot for now. i'm interested to hear what you have to say.

also, when is the best time to take tmg?

finally, what's the best e-mail at which to reach you for setting up a phone consult?

thanks again, james. your help is truly appreciated.

- drew[/quote]


Here is an old response I did in regards to GAPS:

Why do u say that SCD is based on a lot of "faulty science?" It has been around the longest and is scientifically proven. Plus, GAPS is based off of SCD. Could you elaborate?

I am not going to go in to a detailed explanation as it takes way to long. In short though they are not differentiating between the smaller polysaccharides like starches and the more complex polysaccharides like cellulose. The more complex polysaccharides are needed to feed the intestinal flora. They don't differentiate between the good and bad bacteria in the intestines either, and completely miss the mark when they claim the acids formed damage the intestinal lining. The acidity is what helps protect us from pathogens and increases nutrient absorption. And they fail to realize that Bifidobacterium are also essential flora. Basically they are twisting the facts to their needs. This is far from "scientifically proven".


And I see very little in common between SCD and GAPS. SCD is very strict and would not allow most of the foods in the GAPS diet due to the presence of disaccharides and polysaccharides as well as Bifidobacterium that the SCD is against.

What about GAPS don't u agree with and what DO u like about it?

The main things I did not like was their section on toxins such as acetylaldehyde since they fail to take in to account how these things are metabolized in the body. So they are not telling the whole story. And I think they rely to heavily on juices without the fiber when the fiber should not be removed. In fact they should be increasing fiber to help the flora. It does not make sense to take cultured foods for the bacteria then starve the bacteria removing the fiber. And the fiber slows the absorption of sugar, which would be very important in cases such as diabetes.

What I like about it is that at least it is less restrictive than the other diets. But there are still other flaws such as where they recommend raw vegetables such as cabbage that are goitrogenic. Again, this is why I find these strict diets ridiculous. There is NO one size fits all diet, and all strict diets have their issues.


And another one:


LOL... I like your witty short-and-sweet responses, but if you could elaborate, I'd be interested in how u came to that conclusion that "SCD doesn't know that they are talking about."

The fear is that bifidus can lead to SIBO

http://gapsfacts.com/bifidus.html

We can start with the fact that studies have shown that IBS has been linked to a lack of flora, not overgrowth.

Then there is the fact that they are reading a lot more in to the gene transfer part than they should. Just because there is a possibility that gene transfer may occur this does not mean it will. That is like saying there is a possibility of a meteorite hitting you on the head. But that does not mean it will happen or is likely to happen. And even if this does occur mutations occur in the body all the time. Guess what happens to the vast majority of those mutations? They are destroyed by the immune system. So they are trying to attribute what can happen in an Petri dish, when there is no immune system to act on the mutations, and trying to fit it to the real world to fit their needs.

Why is it that everyone has these bacteria and yet there has never been any evidence of these gene transferred mutations leading to pathogenic overgrowth in humans?

And Crohn's is an autoimmune condition triggered by mycobacterium avium complex (MAC), not overgrowth of Bifidus species.

Then they are completely overlooking the fact that bacteria have to compete for food and space so Bifidus strains would be kept in check by these factors as well. Again, Petri dish studies do not correlate to what actually happens in the body.

As for their last link it does not even allow you to scroll to the page they tell you to scroll down to and claim the information is on so the information can be verified or debunked. They should have posted the actual quote they are referring to so people can research the claims further.


And:

How does yucca help dysbiosis?

Yucca helps to hold moisture in the colon providing a better growth environment for the flora and it is also fiber rich to feed the flora. Yucca root also reduces inflammation of the intestine due to the steroidal saponins and due to its supportive effects on the adrenals.

I am following the GAPS diet to heal my gi lining, but they say nooooo complex carbs. Too hard on a weak lining. Body Ecology says to cut them out for 6 to 12 weeks, and then you can do 4 different grains... Buckwheat being one... What are your thoughts on the grain issue?

I disagree with them. The only complex carbs that are going to be hard fibers. But not all grain fibers are hard. This is why when I recommend fibers I recommend rice bran or oat bran. Not only are great nutritional sources but they are also soft fibers. So they are even safe for people with diverticulitis.

I have a broad spectrum probiotic coming from my doctor, 100 billion per scoop, and also inulin. No short chain FOS in there. GAPS says it's bad, but my doc says the good bacteria need it. The company says bad bacteria won't grow from inulin??? Body Ecology says inulin is really good to get the good bacteria to colonize...

What are your thoughts on the subject?

Both FOS and inulin stimulate the growth of the flora.


I thought about ordering chicory root, and eating that with the probiotics. GAPS says no chicory root and no yucca. BED says none in the beggining.

Chicory root not only contains inulin, but also nutritional factors. So there is no reason you should not use it. Yucca root also provides more benefits than FOS or inulin. And it is can help treat leaky gut by reducing the intestinal inflammation.

Bottom line is that restricting fiber will reduce the good bacteria in the intestines. These good bacteria control the bad bacteria through bactercides, peroxides, acids and by competing for food and space. Therefore, restricting fiber is a bad idea.

As for the best time to take TMG, I recommend with meals. The TMG is a solvent and will also help with nutrient absorption.

You can contact me at MMBotanic@aol.com



RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 07-28-2012 05:51 PM

james -

about a month since i last wrote. chest tightness has dissipated, haven't felt it in a few weeks. no problems getting a full breath now. almost certain that was just stress. the pains that went along with it i think i've pinned down to being positional, resulting from a back/neck injury from a few years back. so i'm out of the woods there for now.

the stomach, however, hasn't been doing so well, and i have some links i'd like your input on. i'm still trying to figure out what's going on, and accutane remains one of the main threads i'm following considering i took the drug for about 5 months and now ten years later share symptoms with a lot of post-accutane people.

http://www.uchospitals.edu/news/2011/20110209-celiac-disease.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21307853

http://www.webmd.com/digestive-disorders/celiac-disease/news/20110208/new-treatment-for-celiac-disease

http://ragforum.freeforums.org/accutane-side-effects-could-worsen-celiac-disease-t157.html

all of these links have to do with recent studies linking retinoic acid (accutane) with stimulation of interleukin 15 and thus resulting in inflammatory conditions. specifically here they deal with celiac. i highly doubt that i'm celiac being that i've been strictly gluten free for about six months now with no improvement compared to when i was eating gluten. i'm not a scientist though and don't really understand the implications. is it possible that this process could lead to inflammatory conditions in non-celiacs as well?

also, a popular theme among the accutane forums in reaction to this information is that we should try and eliminate vitamin a or at least the retinol form from our diets. is there any credence to this?

have some more questions for you but i'll let you comment on this first. thanks as always, james.

- drew


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 07-31-2012 12:23 AM

(07-28-2012 05:51 PM)yuba13 Wrote:  james -

about a month since i last wrote. chest tightness has dissipated, haven't felt it in a few weeks. no problems getting a full breath now. almost certain that was just stress. the pains that went along with it i think i've pinned down to being positional, resulting from a back/neck injury from a few years back. so i'm out of the woods there for now.

the stomach, however, hasn't been doing so well, and i have some links i'd like your input on. i'm still trying to figure out what's going on, and accutane remains one of the main threads i'm following considering i took the drug for about 5 months and now ten years later share symptoms with a lot of post-accutane people.

http://www.uchospitals.edu/news/2011/20110209-celiac-disease.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21307853

http://www.webmd.com/digestive-disorders/celiac-disease/news/20110208/new-treatment-for-celiac-disease

http://ragforum.freeforums.org/accutane-side-effects-could-worsen-celiac-disease-t157.html

all of these links have to do with recent studies linking retinoic acid (accutane) with stimulation of interleukin 15 and thus resulting in inflammatory conditions. specifically here they deal with celiac. i highly doubt that i'm celiac being that i've been strictly gluten free for about six months now with no improvement compared to when i was eating gluten. i'm not a scientist though and don't really understand the implications. is it possible that this process could lead to inflammatory conditions in non-celiacs as well?

There are several inflammatory interleukins as well as various other inflammatory factors in the body. Therefore, if you have an inflammatory condition this does not mean that the inflammation is from IL-15.


also, a popular theme among the accutane forums in reaction to this information is that we should try and eliminate vitamin a or at least the retinol form from our diets. is there any credence to this?

I disagree on avoiding vitamin A. Vitamin A is needed by the body in small amounts, particularly for the mucous membranes. But taking large amounts of vitamin A is not a good idea regardless. Generally the safe limit is considered around 10,000IU daily to prevent liver damage. Some studies though have shown that more than 100IU daily can adversely effect bone.

have some more questions for you but i'll let you comment on this first. thanks as always, james.

- drew



RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 07-31-2012 12:50 AM

(07-31-2012 12:23 AM)James Wrote:  
(07-28-2012 05:51 PM)yuba13 Wrote:  james -

about a month since i last wrote. chest tightness has dissipated, haven't felt it in a few weeks. no problems getting a full breath now. almost certain that was just stress. the pains that went along with it i think i've pinned down to being positional, resulting from a back/neck injury from a few years back. so i'm out of the woods there for now.

the stomach, however, hasn't been doing so well, and i have some links i'd like your input on. i'm still trying to figure out what's going on, and accutane remains one of the main threads i'm following considering i took the drug for about 5 months and now ten years later share symptoms with a lot of post-accutane people.

http://www.uchospitals.edu/news/2011/20110209-celiac-disease.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21307853

http://www.webmd.com/digestive-disorders/celiac-disease/news/20110208/new-treatment-for-celiac-disease

http://ragforum.freeforums.org/accutane-side-effects-could-worsen-celiac-disease-t157.html

all of these links have to do with recent studies linking retinoic acid (accutane) with stimulation of interleukin 15 and thus resulting in inflammatory conditions. specifically here they deal with celiac. i highly doubt that i'm celiac being that i've been strictly gluten free for about six months now with no improvement compared to when i was eating gluten. i'm not a scientist though and don't really understand the implications. is it possible that this process could lead to inflammatory conditions in non-celiacs as well?

There are several inflammatory interleukins as well as various other inflammatory factors in the body. Therefore, if you have an inflammatory condition this does not mean that the inflammation is from IL-15.


also, a popular theme among the accutane forums in reaction to this information is that we should try and eliminate vitamin a or at least the retinol form from our diets. is there any credence to this?

I disagree on avoiding vitamin A. Vitamin A is needed by the body in small amounts, particularly for the mucous membranes. But taking large amounts of vitamin A is not a good idea regardless. Generally the safe limit is considered around 10,000IU daily to prevent liver damage. Some studies though have shown that more than 100IU daily can adversely effect bone.

have some more questions for you but i'll let you comment on this first. thanks as always, james.

- drew

so you don't see anything to the retinoic acid/il-15 link from the university of chicago report? i'm trying to chase down the root of what's going on with me since i've tried so many diet/supplement/lifestyle changes over the last year and seem to be only getting worse. where would you suggest beginning to look for identifying the best plan of action?


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 07-31-2012 05:53 AM

[/quote]
so you don't see anything to the retinoic acid/il-15 link from the university of chicago report? i'm trying to chase down the root of what's going on with me since i've tried so many diet/supplement/lifestyle changes over the last year and seem to be only getting worse. where would you suggest beginning to look for identifying the best plan of action?

It sounded like it had been quite a while since you took the Accutane. So the IL-15 levels should have dropped by now, which is why I am not so sure this was the problem. It is possible that the Accutane triggered off an autoimmune disorder that you never recovered from, but I would have expected some positive effects from some of the herbs and supplements you tried. Especially ones for the adrenals.

One thing I would recommend is to focus on addressing what is known first. Looking back over the thread is looks like thyroid is part of the problem. So there is a good start as well as working on your flora and digestion. So many things are interrelated that sometimes working on the known problems will clear up other problems.

Another thing you can do is to make a list of your symptoms and what you have tried comparing what had no effect to what gave you temporary relief or cleared up some symptoms. This can help you see the over all picture and narrow down possibilities. For example, if anti-inflammatory compounds improve some symptoms then this at least tells you that there is an inflammatory component. If taking an acid with meals like betaine HCl or apple cider vinegar helps then this would indicate that a lack of acid could be interfering with nutrient absorption and can be causing the gastorparesis.

[/quote]


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 08-03-2012 08:30 PM

what can you tell me about brans as a fiber source? i know you're big on them, but i've also been warned against them by people who say they leech nutrients from the body. also have heard it is high in phytic acid, http://www.westonaprice.org/food-features/living-with-phytic-acid

any info you can shed on these claims is appreciated, as always.

thanks james.

- drew


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 08-04-2012 06:59 AM

(08-03-2012 08:30 PM)yuba13 Wrote:  what can you tell me about brans as a fiber source? i know you're big on them, but i've also been warned against them by people who say they leech nutrients from the body. also have heard it is high in phytic acid, http://www.westonaprice.org/food-features/living-with-phytic-acid

any info you can shed on these claims is appreciated, as always.

thanks james.

- drew

First of all in my opinion the Weston Price Foundation is a joke a resource for information. I would trust what a politician says before I would trust what the Weston Price Foundation had to say. They are simply a bought and paid for mouthpiece for the beef and dairy industry, and I have written a number of times discrediting the false propaganda they put out.

As for brans there are different types of bran. I am not a big fan of wheat bran, but that is mainly because it is a "hard" bran making it a little harsh on the intestinal walls.

I prefer rice bran or oat bran, which are soft fibers. This also makes them safer for people with inflammatory intestinal conditions such as diverticulitis, Crohn's or ulcerative colitis.

These brans are also great sources of B vitamins.

Non-stabilized rice bran is also a good source of vitamin E and gamma oryzanol, which helps to balance hormones and has anti-cancer activity.

As far as the phytic acid goes, yes these contain phytic acid. Is phytic acid bad? No. It is actually very beneficial. In fact, you can buy it in health food stores as an anti-cancer treatment called inositol hexaphosphate (IP6).

The rumor about phytic acid is that it robs the body of nutrients, which is one of the hyped propaganda claims made by the Weston Price. Phytic acid actually has a higher affinity for dangerous free iron and heavy metals than it does beneficial minerals. Secondly, because phytic acid is a metal binder the phytic acid will already be bound to soil minerals before it is ingested. Therefore, let's say the plant's phytic acid is already bound to calcium the plant picked up from the soil. How can the phytic acid rob the body of anything if it is already bound? The answer is that it cannot. In order for the phytic acid to pick up something else from the body such as mercury the phytic acid must first give up the calcium in an exchange reaction with the mercury that it has a higher affinity for. How can anyone think this is bad or come to the conclusion that the phytic acid is robbing the body of nutrients when in fact this is impossible if from plant sources? The only way is if they absolutely no clue what they are talking about!

Interestingly, Dr. Mercola sits on the board of the Weston Price Foundation and therefore propagates a lot of the same disinformation as the Weston Price Foundation. A lot of this revolves around soy, which Mercola claims is dangerous due to its phytoestrogens, its phytic acid content and what he calls a high oxalic acid content. Problem is that Mercola at the same time considers flax seed very healthy despite the fact that flax seed contains nearly 4 times more phytoestrogens than raw soy. Compared to cooked or fermented soy the percentage of phytoestrogens in flax seed is even higher since the cooking or fermentation of soy reduces its phytoestrogen content. Even funnier is that Mercola sells a resveratrol product that he does not bother to tell his customers is a pure phytoestrogen!!! And I guess Mercola is also unaware of the fact that every plant we consume contains phytoestrogens, and the beef and dairy that the Weston Price Foundation promotes contain real estrogens that are hundreds to thousands of times stronger and thus more dangerous than phytoestrogens. Mercola also fails to mention the high level of phytic acid in flax seed that he and the Weston Price Foundation consider to be so evil. As for the claim of soy being high in oxalic acid nothing could be further from the truth. And of course once again Mercola makes no mention of the oxalic acid content in flax seeds, which is 0.8 to 1.5% making equal to or higher than soy. Here is a link on the oxalic acid content of foods. Look under "beans, soy":

http://oxalicacidinfo.com/

Flax seeds also contain cyanogenic glycosides that suppress the thyroid and that Mercola claims are toxic in this article of his:

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/05/04/13-plants-that-could-kill-you.aspx

I have addressed the phytic acid robbing the body of nutrients myth in previous posts:

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2793

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2792

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2369

And someone else's writings on the myths surrounding soy that include a benefit of phytic acid:

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2364

Bottom line is that the phytic acid being dangerous is just that, a myth.



RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 08-05-2012 01:29 AM

that's good enough for me. i'm gonna go ahead with rice bran and see how that goes.

i also ordered chinese licorice root powder and yucca root powder for gut inflammation. however, i think i remember reading in one of your posts that one of these (maybe both?) inhibited thyroid function. considering my thyroid is low, would you avoid these for now or go ahead with them?

any other anti-inflammatories i should be looking into?

thanks james.

- drew


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - JC73 - 08-05-2012 07:47 AM

How does Mercola and the WAPF explain away the volumes of data from pubmed that demonstrate the benefits of soy?


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - yuba13 - 08-05-2012 11:24 AM

also, james, one final question about rice bran

i pulled this from a gaps faq list:
"Starch is a very specific molecule and it does not exist in Nature in pure form. Grains are not ‘starches’, as they contain hundreds of other substances. Rice, other grains and potatoes contain many anti-nutrients which damage the gut wall. They also cross-react with a gliadin antibody for celiac disease, initiating an autoimmune attack on the gut wall, joints and other connective tissue in the body. You will get plenty of carbohydrates from vegetables and fruit allowed on the GAPS Diet."

i hope it doesn't seem like i'm dwelling here, i just am new to a lot of this stuff and am looking to get informed before i make any decisions. anyway, you've addressed the 'anti-nutrients' thing, but the cross-reaction with giladin/autoimmune stimulation factor has me worried, as i'm pretty sure whatever is going on with me has an autoimmune component. any validity to this?

can't thank you enough, james.

- drew


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - JC73 - 08-06-2012 06:35 AM

Rice, other grains and potatoes contain many anti-nutrients which damage the gut wall.

I don't think so.Starches like potatoes and brown rice are great for healing the gut.


RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 08-07-2012 01:41 AM

(08-05-2012 01:29 AM)yuba13 Wrote:  that's good enough for me. i'm gonna go ahead with rice bran and see how that goes.

i also ordered chinese licorice root powder and yucca root powder for gut inflammation. however, i think i remember reading in one of your posts that one of these (maybe both?) inhibited thyroid function. considering my thyroid is low, would you avoid these for now or go ahead with them?

All plants we consume contain phytoestrogens, which are slightly goitrogenic. This could simply be Nature's way of preventing an overactive thyroid from the iodine in some of the foods we eat such as animal proteins.

On the other hand both herbs support adrenal function, which in turn supports proper thyroid function. So I would not worry about taking these herbs. Especially since they are some of the best herbal anti-inflammatories available.


any other anti-inflammatories i should be looking into?

These are the best, especially since they also support the adrenals, which control inflammation for the body.

thanks james.

You're welcome.

- drew



RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 08-07-2012 02:13 AM

(08-05-2012 07:47 AM)JC73 Wrote:  How does Mercola and the WAPF explain away the volumes of data from pubmed that demonstrate the benefits of soy?

It is easy to find manipulated studies that fit a need if you try. Many of the studies out there trying to show toxicity of a substance involve giving the test animal massive doses of an isolated substance to get adverse reactions. These are what the Weston Price Foundation looks for in studies are studies that have been designed to show adverse effects.

As an example to these studies I have discussed in the past a study where they claimed chromium picolinate caused cancer. If people actually read the study though these adverse effects occurred when they gave mice 6,000 times the level of chromium picolinate than the equivalent recommended human dose. This actually shows considerable safety for chromium picolinate since 6,000 times the normal dose of most anything, including water will kill you right away.

They can also misinterpret studies, which is another common tactic.

As an example here there was a study that claimed vitamin C increased the risk of heart disease. This was based on the misinterpretation of a study that found that supplementing vitamin C thickened arterial walls, which is normal. We need the thicker walls to handle the higher pressures in arteries. But someone misinterpreted this to mean that the arteries were being narrowed and thus increasing the risk of cardiovascular events. This is completely wrong though. The walls of the arteries are muscles that contract and relax as needed to maintain proper pressure and circulation when working properly. If the walls thicken as they are supposed to from the vitamin C the arteries can simply relax maintaining the same blood flow. So the study was misinterpreted to make vitamin C look dangerous when in fact it was being useful. Too weak of arterial walls increases the risk of aneurysm and rupture.

The Weston Price Foundation is financed by the beef and dairy industries and acts like spokespersons for these industries. So the Weston Price Foundation functions like the pharmaceutical companies FDA. The FDA functions primarily to protect the profits of the pharmaceutical companies so they use disinformation about supplements every chance they get. The Weston Price Foundation uses every chance they get to use disinformation to scare people away from the biggest competitors that the beef and dairy industries have, which is soy.

Unfortunately, human nature tends to focus on negativity. So when people hear negative remarks about soy they tend to accept and repeat the misinformation without bothering to research if the claims are true. Since the elections are coming up I will use this as an example. Look at all the negative campaign ads that are flying around. All sides are using false quotes or taking words out of context to bash their competitors. Why? because it works. Again, people tend to focus on and accept negative claims they hear rather than to take the time to find out if the claims are true. Another example of negativity is why do people go to NASCAR races? Not to watch the cars go round and round a circular track for hours. They go because they want to see the carnage of the cars piling up and catching on fire. For some reason humans are more drawn to negativity that positive things in life.



RE: gut/thyroid/adrenal issues - James - 08-07-2012 03:01 AM

(08-05-2012 11:24 AM)yuba13 Wrote:  also, james, one final question about rice bran

i pulled this from a gaps faq list:
"Starch is a very specific molecule and it does not exist in Nature in pure form.

And their point? Using the same reasoning we can also claim that proteins, fats, phytoestrogens, sterols, terpenes, alcohols, saponins, simple sugars, etc. are not specific molecules since they are also combined with hundreds of other substances in foods. So their claim is like holding an empty bucket and claiming you have something. An empty bucket!

Grains are not ‘starches’, as they contain hundreds of other substances. Rice, other grains and potatoes contain many anti-nutrients which damage the gut wall.

This is very misleading. What are often referred to as "anti-nutrients" are not at all. The most common compound referred to as an anti-nutrient is phytic acid, which is extremely beneficial to to the body. I covered this somewhat in this post:

http://medcapsules.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2840&highlight=phytic


They also cross-react with a gliadin antibody for celiac disease, initiating an autoimmune attack on the gut wall, joints and other connective tissue in the body.

I have never seen any evidence to back any part of their claim. It would be nice if they would be more specific as to what compounds they are referring to specifically and provided evidence to their claims.

You will get plenty of carbohydrates from vegetables and fruit allowed on the GAPS Diet."

And they are contradicting themselves quite a bit. I took a look at the GAPS diet:

http://www.gapsdiet.com/The_Diet.html

First they claim:

"The best foods are eggs (if tolerated), fresh meats (not preserved), fish, shellfish, fresh vegetables and fruit, nuts and seeds"

So what do they think grains are? Yes, they are seeds!

An dhow did they overlook the fact that nuts and other seeds also contain phytic acid?

And what about the oxalates in the various foods they mention such as rhubarb, beans and spinach, which can also be considered an "anti-nutrient"?

Then they recommend broccoli, which is goitrogenic. Especially when raw, which they recommend to maintain enzymes.

Then they bash things like seaweeds and astragalus for their polysaccharides while telling people the polysaccharide cellulose is fine. And what about mushrooms, which can be loaded with immune stimulating polysaccharides?

I could go on with examples but the point is already made that they are so full of contradictions to be taken seriously.


i hope it doesn't seem like i'm dwelling here, i just am new to a lot of this stuff and am looking to get informed before i make any decisions. anyway, you've addressed the 'anti-nutrients' thing, but the cross-reaction with giladin/autoimmune stimulation factor has me worried, as i'm pretty sure whatever is going on with me has an autoimmune component. any validity to this?

I doubt it. Again, I have never seen any evidence of this and all their other misinformation calls this claim in to question as well.

can't thank you enough, james.

No problem.


- drew